Tulpa.info - metaphysics

You don't get rid of a crutch without healing the injury first, or at least having something else available

What do you make of the fact that tulpamancers who haven't been indoctrinated by Orthodoxy don't perceive of plurality as an injury and headmates as crutches?

I didn't come here to accuse tulpas of being demons. I don't and can't know that for sure. I'm in this channel specifically because people were claiming that it can be a Christian practice, and that it's "definitely not demonic".

6:19 AM

@Unfastened Belts I can stop drinking anytime I want. It makes me a more fun person

Yeah but comparing plurality to a drinking problem is a ridiculous notion that suggests that plurality is inherently problematic

6:20 AM

Which you would find to be untrue if you spent any time in the community

6:22 AM

I mean then again, maybe not, given your strong convictions based on church doctrines

The doctrines are based in practical spiritual results. That's why they're doctrines

6:24 AM

Sure, but the practical results of people engaging in tulpamancy disagree fundamentally with the results that gave birth to those doctrines as far as harmfulness of plurality goes

Speaking of prelest, this image above is from Orthodoxy and the Religion of the Future

6:26 AM

You don't even know (or are pretending not to know) what the standard for spiritual harm in Orthodoxy even is. How can you say that the results disagree with the doctrines?

Because you've compared plurality to alcoholism, torturing animals and pushing people down stairs. As far as those things go, the Orthodox standard for harm doesn't seem too far removed from common sense

6:30 AM

I read your excerpt there

6:30 AM

Tulpamancy definitely fulfills the second definition of prelest, in that it's not founded on Orthodox doctrine

6:30 AM

But it has nothing to do with the first definition

6:31 AM

Headmates are much more akin to what you condescendingly call "imaginary friends" than any outside entities visiting the body

It's just less grandiose than those examples

6:32 AM

And you're presupposing materialism again, unless you think you can somehow have an imaginary friend with a different subjective viewpoint and not have that constitute a separate being (under any non-materialist system) (edited)

6:33 AM

Materialism explicitly leads to idolatry, which by definition darkens the nous

Headmates are definitely described/experienced as separate beings, but they're not "invited from outside". The standard description is that they are created by the body/mind system in the same way as the host entity, except at a later point in life than the host

6:36 AM

You will find almost no one with a headmate who would describe tulpas as being in a different category than hosts. They are just younger, but they're still created from the same body/mind substance as the host

6:38 AM

Now granted, that could just be because these tulpamancers haven't studied Orthodox doctrine deeply enough... But this is certainly what the experience feels like

6:38 AM

An entity of the same kind, created by the same kind of processes as the "host" (really just meaning first) entity

6:41 AM

The entire idea that tulpas could be "other" kinds of entities is considered so fringe and lunatic that people are compelled to discuss it in this specific channel and nowhere else on the server

6:41 AM

Brb

The idea that you can make another soul within your own body that shares your mind violates the unity of man as mind/body/soul, creating all sorts of problems for theosis which is the ultimate goal of orthodox spirituality

6:46 AM

Not to mention the idea that you've effectively invented a new kind of virgin birth

That may be so

6:49 AM

As long as you understand that you're operating under a pre-conceived notion of what a headmate is that is completely divorced from almost all experiences described by people with actual headmates, we're good

You haven't demonstrated that at all, or even shown how it's relevant to the conversation

6:50 AM

Again, I'm here to explain why Tulpamancy isn't Christian

6:51 AM

Well I was actually here to ask about aphantasia but I got dragged into this

I agree 100 %! (At least it certainly isn't Orthodox, going by your summary right now)

Well I'm glad we worked that out. How's the host doing?

6:52 AM

I'mma post those other caps for the other guy now then head to bed probably

You haven't demonstrated that at all, or even shown how it's relevant to the conversation

I explained how headmates are usually described, you told me that this description violates the unity of man and implies virgin birth. That's all I was trying to demonstrate by saying that your notions of headmates are fundamentally different from those of people who have them

How's the host doing?

I'm really glad I grew up as a Jehovah's Witness. Nothing will cure you from Christianity like being raised in a sect that takes Bible literalism to an extreme

6:56 AM

I read about three quarters of the bible when I was 15, which I recommend as easily the most efficient way to lose your faith

6:57 AM

Gotta go to bed, genuinely enjoyed the discussion

6:58 AM

Good night ❤️

And thanks for engaging me :)

@Unfastened Belts sorry about that, I'm not sure how to @ a bot

7:09 AM

I'll just post some of the caps from Christ the Eternal Tao that I already have then pass out

7:11 AM

7:15 AM

More relevant one:

Similar sentiment from Unseen Warfare as edited by St. Theophan the Recluse and St. Nicodemus of the Holy Mountain:

And again from Fr. Seraphim Rose in Geneses Creation and Early Man, with references:

8:11 AM

And that's all I have relating to imagination etc off the top of my head. (edited)

The one from Unseen Warfare notably puts more of an explicit preeminence on rational thought, but that may be because it was originally a Roman Catholic work that was later edited by Orthodox saints.

8:36 AM

I want to make it clear that I don't consider myself qualified to tell anyone what to do with their tulpas or how that relates to their current mental state, nor do I feel that I absolutely know them to be one form of being or another. Good night

Read all your excerpts, some of their wisdom comes pretty close to what Eastern religious traditions teach

3:42 PM

But their identification of the root cause of unhappiness is of course misguided ;P by Christian doctrine (edited)

3:43 PM

I'll answer in some more detail when I have time

1:44 AM

@Maharani

Haha

What is FSM though?

The Flying Spaghetti Monster

Shoulda figured lol

Gravity isn't real, the FSM holds us down with His countless noodly appendages

He must be... invisible...

Well duh

I've been fooling around with astrology? Astronomy? Recently, and I was wondering, do tulpas have different sun/moon/etc signs from the original?

4:18 AM

I'm not knowledgeable enough on it to know

probably depends on your personal beliefs on the matter all that stuff is based off birth date so if you're doing it body-wide there's that, but if you go by souls or something like that, it would be a different date

I was kinda suspecting the former anyway~ I guess I'll just need to do a chart for my birth date and see if it makes any sense

God don't suck

2:21 AM

standards aren't bad

2:21 AM

failure sucks but not too hard, I mean babies fail absolutely constantly at everything but they smile and giggle about that shit

I mean it sucks that there liekly is no God to give us an eternity in heaven and all that

oh that

2:21 AM

yeah

2:21 AM

naw I don't think about rewards too bad

2:22 AM

I don't want God to be real because I wanna pray forever in Good Boy Club

2:22 AM

I dunno what I want

2:22 AM

I guess I look into the void and I want the void to look back

2:22 AM

that'd be cool

I just hate staring into the portal of absolute and utter undoing all the time (edited)

I'm not scared to die, I have a mild affinity that aides me at times

2:23 AM

I used to be really scared, like just scared that one day I'd get hit by a bus and die, prolly since I almost got hit by a bus once LOL

2:23 AM

now it's like

2:23 AM

that'd be ok

2:23 AM

I sure wouldn't have time to worry about it

I mean dying is bad enough but the prospect that every thing you did will instananously be erased when you die is just brutal

2:24 AM

Meanwhile some people may live it out for a while, but it all fucking returns to zero

there's a song Gavin likes quite a bit

2:24 AM

it just goes,

2:24 AM

In Heaven
Everything is fine
You got your good thing
And I've got mine
In Heaven
Everything is fine

2:24 AM

over and over

2:25 AM

it's being sung about a baby born horribly deformed, and how the father wishes the baby were dead/would die, because when its dead everything will be over, and okay

2:25 AM

Eraserhead, a David Lynch movie

Gosh...what a fucking ridiculous clusterfuck of tragedy and opportunity this version of existence is

while a lady steps on worms

2:25 AM

https://youtu.be/nzp_qv3-FkA

BozOiduts

In Heaven (Everything is fine) HD ORIGINAL

Can I trade in my copy at game stop and get a less bipolar universe

nu

I mean shit yeah life can be pretty bad

2:27 AM

Unbelievably bad